Armenia and Turkey

Togarmah’s earliest descendants settled in Armenia. Hittite documents reveal that in the 14th century BC, the then region of Tegarama (which lay between Carchemish and Haran), was sacked by the enemy from ‘Isuwa’ (beyond the Euphrates). The records of both Sargon II and Sennacherib mention the city of Til-gari-manu, the capital of Kammanu which lay on the border of Tabal. Til-gari-manu lay some thirty miles due east of present-day Malatya (known today as Gürün, anciently Gauraena), and was not finally destroyed until the year 695 BC. It was after the destruction of Til-gari-manu that the descendants of Togarmah became lost in obscurity. In line with the Assyrian policy of that time, the survivors were uprooted and transported to other lands within the Assyrian empire. The name was given as Thrugramma by Josephus. Gomer was the founder of the Cimmerians who settled originally on the shores of the Caspian Sea. They were later driven away by the Elamites. At the time of the Babylonian Exile, the Jews knew them as the tribes that dwelt in the ‘uppermost parts of the north’ (Eze 38:6). The Assyrians referred to them as the Gimirraya. Esarhaddon (681-668 BC) records his defeat of the Gimirrai, whilst King Ashurbanipal tells us in his records of the Cimmerian invasion of Lydia in the days of the Lydian king Gugu around the year 660 BC.  —Bill Cooper

Compare and contrast to this, at

Togarmah was a descendant of Noah through Japheth then Gomer (Gen.10:1-3). He is know to Assyrian records as Tilgarimmu (TLGRM). The inserted “L” is not uncommon and, more than likely, was silent. Tilgarimmu was a city state in Eastern Anatolia (Asia Minor, modern Turkey), more specifically, as Ryrie states, “the southeastern part of Turkey near the Syrian border.” This identification is generally acknowledged by all.

… GMR is well known to the ancient world as Gimarrai (GMR) of north central Asia Minor (Cappadocia). These people are also known as the Cimmerians (KMR, note the change in gutturals from “G” to “C”). This seems to be the simplest, most obvious interpretation.

See The Many Armenian Diasporas, Then and Now.

Armenia and Turkey [Image: Wikimedia Commons]
Turkey is no small or weak country. A population of 75 million supports the second largest standing military force in NATO, of 500,000. Turkey joined the NATO alliance in 1952, after years of secularisation beginning with Kamal Ataturk in the early part of last century. More recently, there has been an Islamist tendency of Turkey’s governments. In the decade up to 2008, Turkey had the most judgements of human rights violations than any other member state of the Council of Europe. The current government has instituted significant restrictions to press freedoms, and for the last two consecutive years more journalists have been imprisoned in Turkey than anywhere else in the world.

See Russia is not in Ezekiel 38

Avi Lipkin:

The 500,000-strong Turkish army would massacre the 40,000 Hezbollah.

Turkey is a fanatic Sunni country with large Shiite (31%) and Kurdish (25%) minorities, and is made up of not just Anatolia, but considers itself also the leader of the six Turkic countries (“Stans”) that broke away from the former Soviet Union; not to mention the tens of millions of Turks living in Western Europe.

As an aside, the Kurds of Turkey could break away to amalgamate with the Kurds of Iraq and Syria and perhaps also Iran’s Kurds to create a Kurdistan. The Kurds and the Jews are friendly to each other; but Turkey is going the way of Saudi Arabia and of Hamas (in Gaza).

The third and final rise of the Turkish Empire …

The Turks were nomads from Mongolia, the area occupied today by the countries known as the “Stans”, and slowly encroached upon Anatolia, a land ruled by the Byzantine Empire for 1000 years — after Rome collapsed in 453 at the hands of the Goths and Visigoths and Huns, the greatness of Rome was transferred to the Eastern Roman Empire.

The Greek Orthodox Church (Byzantine Empire) lasted 1000 years, and today there are few Christians in Turkey — that is, 1000 years later in 1453, the Turks defeated the Byzantines; and the Turks have ethnically cleansed the lands of its Christians.

There are 20,000 Jews in Turkey and the two countries have a good relationship, including weapons trade of over 1 billion dollars a year (from Israel to the Turks). But something has been changing. And it’s not a good change.

Turkey ethnically cleansed 1.5 million (one third) Armenians in 1914. The lack of response of the world gave Hitler the impetus to later carry out his plans, killing one-third of all Jews on earth. Unlike the Germans, the Turks refuse to recognise the sin of genocide. Furthermore, the Turks war crimes include the ethnic cleansing of the Kurds and refusing to give 20 million Kurds a state of their own.

And the world chastises Israel for failing to give 1 million Palestinians a state of their own and all when 70% of Jordan is Palestinian, and they have a second Palestinian state in Gaza ruled by the Hamas. What they want now is another Palestinian state ruled by the PLO/Fatah, in the West Bank.

Iran, Turkey, and Morocco are the last three Jewish Diasporas in the Islamic world — Turkey for not much longer.

Arab Invasions: Muhammad starts his Islamic wars …

The Arabs conquered Spain, Portugal, and France in 711 after conquering North Africa, the Middle East, and Arabia; massacring Jews and Christians who did not convert to Islam while those allowed to survive were second-class citizens (dhimmi). During the time of the Crusades — rise of Seljuk and later Ottoman Turks and then wave after wave of tribesman from the Steppes, and during the 13th-14th centuries the Turks and Mongols converted to Islam, and by 1453 a new power was on the scene — Islamic, Ottoman Turkey.

Ferdinand and Isabella of Spain expelled the Jews in 1492, because the Jews were aligned with the Muslims — at that time in history the Moroccan and Turkish Muslims were better to the Jews than the Catholics were. Spain had three Islamic invasions (and almost a fourth): the 711 Arab invasions; an 11th Century Almohadit (Moroccan) invasion; and a 12th Century Almohad (Moroccan) invasion.

In 1492 Morocco was under the suzerainty of Turkey — the reason Ferdinand and Isabella had to expel the last Moorish king from Grenada was to ensure there was no back door in Spain to allow a fourth Islamic invasion, this time led by the Turks (i.e. the Turks were about to invade Spain in 1492).

In 1389 the Turks defeated the local Christians (Serbs) and then fought at the Battle of Kosovo Field before going on to conquer Albania, Yugoslavia, Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, parts of the Ukraine: the Arabs invaded Europe from the West and the Turks invaded Europe from the East.

In 1588, the Catholic Spanish Fleet was wiped out in a massive sea battle by the British & Dutch (Protestant) navies. Seventeen years earlier (1571), at the Battle of Lepanto, the Spanish fleet wiped out the Turkish fleet in the Mediterranean — this was the beginning of the end of the Islamic Ottoman Empire) — i.e. until 1571 it was the Turks that controlled the Mediterranean. Indeed, the Turks were at the gates of Vienna for 200 years.

1683 was the beginning of the end of the Turkish siege of Vienna and soon after, following 150 years of Ottoman occupation, the Hungarians were freed and the Romanians were freed. This was a process of hundreds of years of wars and battles and persecutions of the Turks against the Christians.

1902, 1903, and then 1912 was the Third War of the Balkans in which the final borders of Europe were drawn — Turkey was forced back to what is Anatolia and a little across the Dardanelles of what is Turkey today in Europe. The wars with Turkey ended but a century ago. In WWI the Turks were allied with the Germans. Turkey was pushed back out of Europe only a hundred years ago, and this after almost a millennium of control in Eastern Europe.

In 1923, during the great Greco-Turkish war in which Atatürk defeated Venizelos, the population of Greece was 10 million Christians and the population of Islamic Turkey was 10 million. Today, in the 21st century, the population of Greece is 10 million Christians (just as it was 100 years ago) but the Islamic Turks are 70 million. In 1974, the Turks came and occupied 40% of Cyprus. Turkey has its eyes set on Cyprus. Turkey has its eyes set on Eastern Greece. 100,000 Turkic Muslims currently live in Eastern Greece.

Bill Clinton supported the wrong side in the Balkan wars, with the break-up of the former Socialist Republic of Yugoslavia: Bill Clinton supported the Muslims in Bosnia at the expense of the Serbs (Christians), allies of the Jews and Christians in WW1 and WW2. Then the Clinton administration supported the Albanian Muslims in Kosovo, who basically invaded (over centuries) Serb land. And so today, thanks to Bill Clinton, there is not one Islamic Republic in Europe but three — Albania, Bosnia, Kosovo. The fourth Islamic Republic will be Macedonia (today 40% Muslim) because the US supports the Muslims (because the Muslims have the oil, the petrodollars, and the numbers).

The Christians, the Serbs, the Macedonians, and the Israelis are to be sacrificed because they don’t have the oil, they don’t have the petrodollars, they don’t have the money.

Turkey used to reach the Adriatic Coast (i.e. Albania, Bosnia, Kosovo, Macedonia, Greece were all part of Turkey) just across from Italy. The Turks dream to return to their conquest. Morocco, Algeria, the whole African Coast was once part of Turkey. Turkey was an empire that went from the Atlantic all the way to China.

Xinjiang province, a desert area full of oil [and] making up one-sixth of China, has a majority Turkic population — the Ouigours, Turkic Muslims with their capital in Urumqi. The Islamic world today is supporting an irredentist [advocating the restoration to their country of any territory formerly belonging to it] rebellion by these Turkic Muslims in China to break away from China and form a new country called East Turkistan. To add to the six republics that broke away from Russia, the Islamic plan is to have a seventh Islamic republic to break away from China.


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